Is This Bizarro World Rotary Powered Porsche 968 Awesome Or Terrible?

"DailyTurismo" (thedailyturismo) 07/23/2015 at 14:36 • Filed to: Daily Turismo, Blog, Porsche, Mazda

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The Porsche 968 was the swan song for Porsche’s attempt at replacing the 911 with a font engined 2+2, and arguably the best looking of the 924/944/928/968 group. The elegant design is attributed to Dutch born Harm Lagaay who also designed the BMW Z1, Ford Scorpion/Sierra, Porsche 924, Boxster, Cayenne, 996, & Carrera GT (but he was not, as it might seem, the inspiration for Ferrari’s latest hypercar name.) However, for some strange reason, the folks at Porsche decided it needed a huge inline-4 mated to a transaxle, when what it needed was some pizzazz under the hood, something like a straight-8, or a turbocharged 2-stroke...or perhaps even a rotary engine would have given the 968 the wow factor it lacked. Find this 1992 Porsche 968 convertible with 13B rotary swap !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! currently bidding for $1,825 reserve-not-met with $7,500 buy-it-now, located in Edmonds, WA

My first thought when I saw an rotary powered 968 was, what sort of abomination is this? A few gin and tonics later (it was, after all, well past noon) and the idea started to seem less objectionable. Why shouldn’t a vehicle with such an elegant design have exotic spinning bits under the hood. Sure, the original Porsche engine makes about a millionty times the torque, but sometimes half the fun is making noise.

The original 3.0 liter inline-4 (rated at 240 horsepower) has been thrown asunder for a nice custom build 4-port Mazda 13B from a 2nd generation RX-7. The twin rotor 1.3 liter spinner would have put out 160 horsepower when new, but now it has been given a “street port” and should burn a lot more oil make some more power, but still less than the original Porsche torque monster.

On the inside it will be difficult to tell that this 968 is Mazda powered...but the funny part is how much of a full circle this car has created. The FC generation RX-7 was heavily influenced by the original 924 and dimensionally very similar...so to have that RX-7 engine in a Porsche descended from the 924 is extremely ironic.

See another Morsche RX68 or Pazda 967 for sale? !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!!

Originally published as !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! on !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! .

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > DailyTurismo 07/23/2015 at 14:40

5

Why do this to a V8 Porsche when there are unloved 924s still out there rotting away?

kanadanmajava1 > DailyTurismo 07/23/2015 at 14:41

2

I think that’s pretty good idea.

Party-vi > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie 07/23/2015 at 14:43

29

*I4 Porsche. It’s a 968.

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > Party-vi 07/23/2015 at 14:45

0

Oops, got my numbers confused.

BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. > DailyTurismo 07/23/2015 at 14:50

9

Very interesting.

Porsche experimented with Felix Wankel’s engine in the 1970s, with 914... but ultimately stuck to boxers, and I4/V8 for their front-engined cars.

A front wankel rotary, and a rear 6-speed transaxle... is very interesting.

Although, I would probably have gone down a road toward a 968 Turbo RS replica road/race car with a race-built rotary, rather than a cruiser 968 convertible.

Rotaries make great race motors, their benefits are well suited for racing, and their drawbacks for road use (oiling at low RPMs and high-load such as the Renesis engines, emissions controls, fuel economy, periodic overhaul, etc...) are a moot point on a screaming race car.

RallyWrench > DailyTurismo 07/23/2015 at 14:53

16

If this was a coupe, I might be a little dismayed. But it’s a cab, so it was already ruined.

dogisbadob > DailyTurismo 07/23/2015 at 14:55

6

pop-up headlights yay

Goggles Pizzano > DailyTurismo 07/23/2015 at 14:56

3

Has ruined 50/50 weight distribution. Neat though.

Justin Hughes > DailyTurismo 07/23/2015 at 15:02

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DailyTurismo > Goggles Pizzano 07/23/2015 at 15:05

4

50/50 —Would hoon.

DailyTurismo > dogisbadob 07/23/2015 at 15:06

13

Not just pop ups, but needlessly exposed pop-ups. Love em!

RazoE > dogisbadob 07/23/2015 at 15:10

2

I always hated the frog-eyes. Terrible design.

Loping Camshaft > RazoE 07/23/2015 at 16:05

1

I don’t like them either, but I’m sure they’re more aerodynamic than most other boxy pop-ups.

BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. > Goggles Pizzano 07/23/2015 at 16:08

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If anything, the rotary may be lighter than the 3.0 Variocam I4 engine... as well as being significantly shorter, putting the engine’s center of mass further behind the front axle line.

If anything, it is MORE like a mid-engined car, not less... and probably also lowered the center of gravity, also. Cylinder heads are heavy, and vertical or slanted engines put them high above the crankshaft and correspondingly, above the ground. A Rotary’s mass is more compact, and shorter both in height and length.

Goggles Pizzano > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. 07/23/2015 at 17:03

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Exactly. By “ruin” I didn’t mean less like a mid-engined car. I meant it would become anything other than the ideal (in some people’s minds) 50/50 with more weight on the rear.

Agree with the center of gravity being better.

BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. > Goggles Pizzano 07/23/2015 at 17:49

0

I guess an aft-mid, or rear-engined car would be ruined, then... with distinctly rear biased weight distribution, for those people’s minds.

Funny, though, I always thought more contact pressure on the motive tires, and a bit less pressure and less front-biased polar moment of inertia was better, both for accelerative traction, and lighter, more precise steering feel, rather than strictly adhering to a 50/50 balance.

Not to say that a 50/50 balance isn’t an admirable goal for a car with most of the driveline weight forward of the center of mass... most front-engined cars that don’t have a rear transaxle can only wish to approach 50/50.

As cool as this 968 is... a wankel-swapped 914 or 986 would be even better.

PardonMyFlemish16 > Goggles Pizzano 07/25/2015 at 09:30

2

A rearward balance is better. See: MR cars. Why? 50/50 distribution under braking, more traction on the rear wheels under acceleration, less understeer.

All that said this thing needs turbo power bad. But its a cab so the whole thing is pointless.

LongbowMkII > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 09:31

0

FC>this

1965gto > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. 07/25/2015 at 09:32

0

Ugh, just say no!

DrGonzho > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 09:35

1

That interior still looks amazing to this day. Minimalistic, but still luxurious.

Something tells me most modern-era interiors won't age nearly as well.

move-over-peasant-I-have-an-M5-in-the-shop > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 09:42

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This is the wrong Porsche/Mazda mashup. What we need is a 911 H6 in a Miata.

simon_C > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 09:45

1

factsonly1 > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 09:48

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This is a must have. Wooooow.

Hunter3203 > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 09:50

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This should be a Nice Ride or Crack Pipe vehicle. I vote Crack Pipe.

Eezep > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 09:51

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To me, 968s feel heavier than they are, which makes me guess that a rotary, especially a normally aspirated one, is not a good fit.

phillipm > PardonMyFlemish16 07/25/2015 at 09:52

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Bingo, 50/50 weight distribution is something for the plebs who’ve watched too many BMW marketing averts to talk about down the pub.

Back in the real world, means f*** all.

chicagoE36 > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 09:55

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Well, they look alike enough already. Might as well share an engine.

Conza > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 09:55

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If you study your Porsche history a little deeper, you’ll find the 968 was based upon the 944, which was a redesigned 924, which was made to replace to 912E and 914 as the entry level Porsche, not the 911. The 928 was the car designed to replace the 911, this is where you’re getting confused, the 928 was the first and last attempt to replace the 911 with a front engined car.

Vin > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 09:58

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What in the hell....?

ElijahV > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 09:59

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This guy has been driving around in that for years now, I've seen it around town and on Craigslist quite a few times. Must have some shred of reliability if he's had it this long

Vin > Vin 07/25/2015 at 10:00

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It’s just...

Vin > Vin 07/25/2015 at 10:00

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...what in the hell ?

Nauraushaun > PardonMyFlemish16 07/25/2015 at 10:01

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I don’t think better is the right word. Better for some applications maybe. More agile, less predictable at the limit. Not always what you want in a road car, particularly a big GT car.

Nauraushaun > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 10:02

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but sometimes half the fun is making noise

Just ask your average Honda owner

Chally72 > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 10:06

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The answer to the question no one asked:

“How do we make this car even LESS reliable?”

Chally72 > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 10:07

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Literally bargain bin parts from the 928’s, though they do look very pretty on these cars I think.

Fluffy6079 > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 10:08

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Crack pipe.

imgonnamakeyouloveme > DrGonzho 07/25/2015 at 10:08

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Agreed....but the interior might be the only part of the car that I like. And what’s the deal with the emergency brake being next to the door? It seems like you’d smack into that a lot when getting in and out.

DoYouEvenShift > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 10:21

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Ok Ill be that guy. LS1/2 swap

godblessE39 > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 10:22

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Hmm. To convert it back to an I4 would be incredibly expensive and not worth it with very, very nice 968 cabs going as high as 25 grand.

CO2dude > dogisbadob 07/25/2015 at 10:29

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Looks like partially popped-up pop-up headlights to me...

Rob Emslie > Hunter3203 07/25/2015 at 10:31

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It was , and it is.

DarklordCaterpie > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 10:31

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That's a big heaping helping of nope.

prisoners > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 10:40

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RalphieDC > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 10:44

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I’m going with terrible, not because I’m a purist, but because they did all that work with out increasing power, improving power band or making it more reliable. And if you care about this in your sportscars - worse gas mileage (and oil mileage).

Old-Busted-Hotness > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. 07/25/2015 at 10:46

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You’re dreaming if you think there’s a traction problem with a torqueless wonder 13B under the hood.

Although you could argue that a rear weight bias makes it more of a Porsche.

Jakkal > Goggles Pizzano 07/25/2015 at 10:48

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All the easier to slide if it can pendulum lol

Hunter3203 > Rob Emslie 07/25/2015 at 10:51

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Lol. And then they recycle the story 2 years later?

Rob Emslie > Hunter3203 07/25/2015 at 10:55

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Not recycling, just revisiting an interesting car that’s once again turned up.

OKcarburetor > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 10:57

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Garbage, but probably better garbage than the 3 liter. They replaced the worst engine ever, with the worst engine ever.

Vic788 > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 10:59

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+A for trying

tobythesandwich > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 11:01

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“The Porsche 968 was the swan song for Porsche’s attempt at replacing the 911 with a font engined 2+2, and arguably the best looking of the 924/944/928/968 group. “

Lol no. The 924/944/968 was NEVER designed to replace the 911 with a front engine 2+2. That was the 928, and that was a backup plan in case rear engine cars were going to be banned from sale in the US in the 70’s.
Also the 968 is the worst of the group. The awkward frog-like pop up headlights and the boring rear are absolutely terrible design cues. The side profile and roofline are pretty much softened carryover from the 924 CGT/944. And the interior is basically the same thing that they had been using since late 1985.

On that note... A rotary powered 968 is for the person who especially hates reliability.

tobythesandwich > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie 07/25/2015 at 11:02

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Because even a V8 Porsche is an unreliable disaster. The 928 was an absolute nightmare.

dogisbadob > CO2dude 07/25/2015 at 11:12

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still good though :)

Bulletkol > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 11:12

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Um, just a minor thing, but if the engine truly is a 4 port na as the pictures indicate it isn’t out of an FC. The engine pictured looks much more like the engine out of the 84-85 first gen GSL SE, which also makes the engine a 12a. All NA FC’s had a 6 port engine (with the secondary ports opening at higher rpms), only the turbo FC’s came in 4 port form.

I’m gonna stop being that guy now and go back to fixing my FC.

Mr Joshua > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 11:16

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I know I shouldn’t but I actually like it. It appears to be a very clean, well done conversion.

PardonMyFlemish16 > Nauraushaun 07/25/2015 at 11:21

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911s are great GT cars. Maybe the best. There is no reason for a sports car or GT to have more than 1300-1400lbs on its nose IMO. GTs can be luxurious and light.

Dpanzerman > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 11:22

0

NEIN!!! DAS IST VERRUCKT!

Okay, it’s cool!

rb1971 ARGQF+CayenneTurbo+E9+328GTS+R90S > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 11:25

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Er - if you want a rotary powered 968 convertible, why wouldn’t you just buy a second generation RX7 convertible? I don't get this idea and I normally love frankenstein engine swaps.

Nauraushaun > PardonMyFlemish16 07/25/2015 at 11:26

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That’s true, but it’s only because Porsche have spent decades trying to tone down the car’s inherent rear-engined behaviors. Before that they were known for killing people.

But I’m not trying to say GT cars can’t be mid-engined, just that it’s not simply a case of mid-engine = better every time.

PardonMyFlemish16 > Nauraushaun 07/25/2015 at 11:36

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The rear engined behaviors weren’t really the issue. It was the awful suspension tuning, tire choices and short wheelbase. Most sports cars in the 60s were not much better. But now the 911 is safe, and has a dynamic balance no other car can match.

Most sports cars/GTs are front engined because it’s cheaper. For driving engagement and balance front engine cars are objectively worse, no question about it.

elvisizer > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 12:03

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take the rotary out and put in an LS . . .then you’d have something.

JimSlade > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 12:03

2

Terrible. CP for this car.

It's been noted in my other comments that I'm looking for a porsche. This one seduced me until I saw that engine. NO NO NO.

Fuel_of_Satan > DoYouEvenShift 07/25/2015 at 12:11

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They do 4-cylinder LS engines?

GhostZ > PardonMyFlemish16 07/25/2015 at 12:14

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Rearward balance isn’t inherently better, centralized mass (low second moment) and smaller form factor is the reason MR cars are used as sports cars.

You can make a car 50/50 weight balance easily by just hanging weight on the overhangs of the front or rear wheels accordingly, but that is going to ruin your handling. The 50/50 weight balance argument is a bit flawed, weight balance matters so much less than density distribution, second moment, tire size/position, drivetrain/throttle latency and many more factors.

DailyTurismo > Nauraushaun 07/25/2015 at 12:16

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Just ask your average Hoover owner

FIFY

DailyTurismo > RalphieDC 07/25/2015 at 12:17

5

You had me at “oil mileage”

DailyTurismo > Mr Joshua 07/25/2015 at 12:19

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Gary Busey seal of approval!! YES!!

Nigel the 968's pilot > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 12:43

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I have the corner balance data to prove the 50/50.. and that balance inspires a lot of confidence (and fun) at the track!

DailyTurismo > Nigel the 968's pilot 07/25/2015 at 12:44

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Nigel — this is your car? Awesome!

Nigel the 968's pilot > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 12:53

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This is Nigel in his native environment...

Ike B > Justin Hughes 07/25/2015 at 12:59

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Exactly. No rotary swap is ever good. None, ever. Forget that they burn apex seals, oil and way too much gas. I have a lot of respect for the creative engineering and the huge hp per liter, but God, they just sound like shit.

Replacing that burly, deep throbbing burble in that amazing 3 liter four banger is just a crime.

Manifold engines > rb1971 ARGQF+CayenneTurbo+E9+328GTS+R90S 07/25/2015 at 13:06

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Headroom, my friend, headroom - RX7s suck for the tall, even with the top down. I hate looking over the windshield.

DoYouEvenShift > Fuel_of_Satan 07/25/2015 at 13:19

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http://hooniverse.com/2013/05/07/lor…

Well, this guy does

Lawyer_Applegate > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 13:20

0

Mazda RX-7s improve with an LS swap. Porsche 968s improve with an LS swap. This is retrograde and perverse.

none8239487234 > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 13:43

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While I do love a car that will make a Porsche purist go crazy another engine choice would have been better. The Chevy V8’s are always a good option. When the power plant in my 1989 944 goes Kaput I’m going to go with an Audi inline 5. The sound is wonderful and if you go for a turbo version the power is too.

Manifold engines > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 13:49

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What are the smog laws there? I built a Rx924 over 25 years ago and finally had to stop driving it due to the California Smog Nazis.

http://jalopnik.com/1978-rx924-my-…

Koshchei > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 14:15

0

Is that a wine cork I see plugging a hose just below the intake?

PardonMyFlemish16 > GhostZ 07/25/2015 at 14:21

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Not disagreeing with other more important factors, but on the basis of weight distribution rearward bias is better.

olpetey > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 14:22

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Good article, except for the 1st sentence. The 928 was a failed 911 replacement, not the others. The 924 was completely unrelated to the 928, and was going to be a VW sports car designed by Porsche. VW backed out at the last minute, and Porsche decided to go ahead with it on their own. And then the 944 and 968 developed out of the 924.

rb1971 ARGQF+CayenneTurbo+E9+328GTS+R90S > Manifold engines 07/25/2015 at 14:48

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Fair enough. My 5’7” self did not notice this issue.

Fuel_of_Satan > DoYouEvenShift 07/25/2015 at 15:08

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Ah yes, I forgot about that guy! Thanks!

Ark > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 15:16

1

Blegh. Not a fan.

bingoaway > Fuel_of_Satan 07/25/2015 at 15:44

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Saab Sonett/Ford Taunus V-4? I thought cathedral ports were a relatively new thing, though.

Sissyfoot > tobythesandwich 07/25/2015 at 16:24

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Hey, guys. I found the 911 owner.

DailyTurismo > Rob Emslie 07/25/2015 at 17:12

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Lol indeed. It looks like it is being sold by the person who picked it up from that sale. Wonder how many apexs it’s been through.

DailyTurismo > none8239487234 07/25/2015 at 17:13

1

I approve of this message. Inline-5 all things.

Color-Commentary > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 17:20

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Right now it’s got 20 bids and is $5,600. I guess you could pull out the underpowered rotary and put in an LS1/LS2 for about $10k, and have a fun $15k car.

But this is not a project that speaks to me at all, and I own two 944s, so I’m probably more likely than most to sign up for such shenanigans.

Color-Commentary > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie 07/25/2015 at 17:21

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That’s a good idea. The Audi-engined 924s are basically worth negative money right now - a ported 13B would make a lot of sense in that (much lighter) chassis.

GoKart_MoZart > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 17:21

1

So what is the rest of the story on the car? Creamed by a train or something? Nice-Nice-Nice car please clarify?

tobythesandwich > Sissyfoot 07/25/2015 at 17:27

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lol not even close. If you’re going to write/blog on a site for car enthusiasts... At least post the correct information. I love the 924/944 and 928. I actually like how the 968 drives, but it is not a good looking car.

You also assume I’m a 911 owner like it’s a bad thing. I’ll be sure to put a Porsche badge on my Xterra.

NoahFect > RallyWrench 07/25/2015 at 18:22

2

I owned one. 968 cabs are damned nice ragtops. The rear end will never look like anything but the box it came in — it’s a conversion and not an original factory design, after all — but there were things about the 968 I liked that my current-generation 981 Boxster doesn’t live up to. (The ability to drive it in the rain with the top down, for one.)

This is one of those cars you don’t want to dis until you’ve driven it. Someone needs to buy it and put the correct engine back in.

Fuel_of_Satan > bingoaway 07/25/2015 at 19:13

0

See the response from “DoYouEvenShift”. That’s a 100% real V4 LS engine.

Captain_Spadaro > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 20:22

0

NasalRadiator911 > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 20:36

0

Abomination. Now, if you made this car into a 968 Turbo replica, that’s awesome. I know a guy that has a factory 968 Turbo S. It is rare and delicious.

BenLikesCars > DailyTurismo 07/25/2015 at 21:14

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To remind: I read the ad and the person who did the conversion received this car without any engine or transaxle. They had a rotary engine lying around, and this happened.

BenLikesCars > Fuel_of_Satan 07/25/2015 at 21:15

1

like a latter-day Iron Duke, could be fun

Kylemaro > DoYouEvenShift 07/25/2015 at 23:02

1

that looks like the mast motorsports 4cyl ls engine during development

DoYouEvenShift > Kylemaro 07/25/2015 at 23:21

0

Mast is working on one? I had no idea! Sounds amazing!

Kylemaro > DoYouEvenShift 07/26/2015 at 00:01

1

yeah theres all different cyl variationsof ls engines now 4 6 8 10 12 one guy was even working on a 16 lol